Something that seriously needs to be changed around here.

Kitashi · Post by **Kitashi** » February 5th, 2012, 11:26 pm

This thread will basically be a continuation of what was discussed in the "Techno or trance artists?" thread, so if this looks like something you're not going to want to get involved in, then please don't.
Although I will not say any names, it'll be easy to guess who I'll referring to in here. Yes, I will probably end up offending those people by doing this.
I know that the forum's most prominent rule is to show respect to others, but I'm hoping that the staff will understand given these circumstances that I feel should really be brought attention to.

Lately, I've been hearing from the admins that they aren't exactly happy with how the forums are now. First, it was Kirby saying that she didn't particularly like what the forum has turned into these days. Then, Maikel said he didn't feel comfortable being around here anymore. I don't have time to go on the forums very often but after having a look-see at how things typically go around here, I can only guess why this is.

Everybody in this community loves music, right? And everyone likes this thing called Nightcore, isn't it?
I've seen that some of you have taken a liking to uploaders who make "Nightcore" versions out of just about any multilingual song they can get a hold of without ANY sort of regards to the genre whatsoever. Better yet, you make frequent rituals to these uploaders.
There's also the lot of you who seem to believe that making "Nightcore" versions out of rock songs is a perfectly acceptable and respectable act and that such songs deserve to be put under the same rave/dance category other Nightcore songs are, as well as worshipping/promoting the uploaders that do this.
People often resort to making "Nightcore" versions out of the typical rap/R&B/pop songs you hear on the radio. Some of you applaud these people for their blatant efforts and astounding amounts of originality.
I could even start with those of you who make and/or enjoy "Nightcore" versions of house/dubstep music, too.

First of all, I'm going to say that there's absolutely nothing wrong with you liking these kinds of music, and that everyone is entitled to their own music tastes no matter what.

There is, however, something VERY wrong with you claiming to be Nightcore fans and being part of a Nightcore community because of said music.

Do not even once claim that you are Nightcore fans, because you. are. NOT. You are fans of fast music.

And you have NO idea how DISRESPECTFUL you're being to Maikel on so many levels, or to anyone who cares about the integrity of this community as a whole.

Heck, some of you might actually owe him an apology.

Let me remind you (or educate you if you didn't know) that the only reason why Nightcore exists today is because of the original Nightcore group, being composed of Thomas S. Nilsen and Steffen Ojala Søderholm. They released five known albums containing SOLELY TECHNO/DANCE tracks. They have an official Myspace page, which you can view here: http://www.myspace.com/nightcore

And what you will find there is this quote:
We mix techno/dance music into faster and more happier sounds for your listening pleasure!
And what you will find there is their genre:
Happy Hardcore / Techno / Trance

I'll also remind (or educate you) that two and a half years ago, the reason why this forum was created was as a means to DISCUSS MAIKEL'S MUSIC. It started off after Maikel received this very message:

Michael circa June 2009 wrote: Im bored so im wondering if you want me to make you a forum, for people to discuss you music and stuff, note this will be free, im just bored lol If u accept the above ill also make you a banner or a forum signiture and other gfx for free as well.

Although it's undergone several changes in location as well as an owner change since then, that principle still stands.
For me, at least.

For many of you, it doesn't. Regardless of the fact that this forum wouldn't have gotten anywhere at all if Maikel wasn't there for the forum to hold on to like a CRUTCH, being the very first to publicize it. His links at the top of every single video he has were the forum's only source of members for a good long while until we managed to get on Google search results. Even then, that was only because of what he did. You should try editing the descriptions of 200+ videos at a time. It's not easy. And you should be grateful that he even continues to do so.

But no. There's those of you who put people who just want to make a Nightcore song out of every language there is at much higher regards and respect than people like Maikel, who actually KNOWS and CARES about what Nightcore originally was and SHOULD be. And then not give a fucking damn about whether he, Kirby, or anyone likes that or not! I'm not going to let this go ignored any longer.

OPEN. YOUR. EYES.

Please keep in mind that I'm not saying that everyone needs to have Maikel as their favorite uploader, or that everyone on this forum needs to have a unified point of view. I'm not suggesting that anyone should get banned or punished over this, either.
I simply believe that we, as the premier Nightcore community on the web, should hold a greater appreciation for good, authentic Nightcore and the uploaders that acknowledge this rather than falling head over heels for the people who clearly have no clue what Nightcore is or the songs they make, which aren't Nightcore songs, but speed edits.

Thank you.

RaveComing · Post by **RaveComing** » February 5th, 2012, 11:45 pm

I am only to be in approval with Kitashi's post, no matter how sensless it might look to most of you guys. Back NightcoreUniverse.com, YES .COM, people were, without revering to Maikel as a God, conscious that it was thanks to him that Nightcore was into our lives; without him, I have no doubt that it would have crippled in downtown Oslo under the form of a few rotting CDs. And so we took him as an example when making our Nightcores, for it was he who knew the most and so it was only fair that we should listen to him.

I am thouroughly ashamed of this community when I see people making House Nightcore or Nighstep (which really stands for Nightcore + Dubstep). I am all the more ashamed when I see people revering such tracks. DO NOT say that you enjoy House Nightcore or Dubstep Nightcore (or Rock or Metal or Folk or[...]) As Kitashi said, you like Sped up music; fast music. There is a huge difference and I trust that you can understand it.

The Nightcore community dates from years back and what you bad uploaders are doing is destroying it. It is vulgar, indecent, a huge lack of respect thowards Maikel, Michael and the whole Nightcore project. It is a lack of respect at the intention of Thomas S. Nilsen and Steffen Ojala Søderholm. It is a lack of respect to me and as much as I have endured, I am begining to feel not unlike Maikel, sickened, disgusted. Anyone that think can oppose Kitashi's post is welcomed to try, but be ready for a fiery debate which might not end well for we know more about Nightcore than you do by any means.

Maikel's forum title is "Teh Nightcore Source" for a reason, you'd do well to remember that.

Post by **Kirby** » February 6th, 2012, 12:15 am

Very well said, although I would have to agree with RaveComing that the subject matter of your post goes far beyond what people of the current Nightcore Universe would know. That doesn't mean that it doesn't concern everyone here, however -- people who were part of the past forums would just have a much easier time understanding how important this is to us.

Post by **appler** » February 6th, 2012, 12:28 am

I've been here for what 6(ish) months and i even understand what he is trying to say (most of it anyway)

Website · Post by **Raver** » February 6th, 2012, 12:45 am

When you are naming rock/pop/house/etc as Nightcore, you're putting people who speed up these songs in the same level as Maikel level, which is offensive in so many aspects I could write a book listing them.

Bevarii · Post by **Bevarii** » February 6th, 2012, 2:03 am

True, I've just started to search songs to Nightcore and I don't even THINK about using songs other than the Techno/Dance/Electronic genre, because that just wouldn't reach the same effect.

jordesu · Post by **jordesu** » February 6th, 2012, 2:25 am

A relatively valid point. Could have been said in fewer paragraphs, took me a while to read that.
Although all I'm trying to say is that people speeding up other genres of music was influenced from Nightcore's original idea.

Other genres of music being sped up is almost like an evolvement.

Post by **Kestrel0907** » February 6th, 2012, 5:06 am

I'll immediately rename all the songs named Nightstep to speed edits after i come back from school...
I'm sorry for all the problems i've caused by naming these songs this way...i've read everything and i'm now ashamed of myself....
And...if there is any other problems regarding my other videos,tell me and i'll immediately rename/remove them.

RaveComing · Post by **RaveComing** » February 6th, 2012, 10:24 am

jordesu wrote:Other genres of music being sped up is almost like an evolvement.

Not even, it is more of a regression. We wouldn't care if people just uploaded their sped up rock/house/dubstep/etc songs on youtube if they were labeled AS SUCH.

The point of this post seems to be about drawing the line between Nightcore and generic speed edits, which I can only approve and endorse myself.

Moonightcore · Post by **Moonightcore** » February 6th, 2012, 11:56 am

Kitashi, i really understand what you're saying and I didn't know about many things you mention there, so, I'm sorry.

Post by **Black Cat** » February 6th, 2012, 12:15 pm

Kirby wrote:Very well said, although I would have to agree with RaveComing that the subject matter of your post goes far beyond what people of the current Nightcore Universe would know. That doesn't mean that it doesn't concern everyone here, however -- people who were part of the past forums would just have a much easier time understanding how important this is to us.

I understand what Kitashi is trying to say but I didn't know anything about this until now. I don't know if that is because I haven't been into much lately.

I'll keep my eyes on this thread but I'll be quiet since I don't really have anything to say.

RaveComing · Post by **RaveComing** » February 6th, 2012, 1:32 pm

Moonightcore wrote:Kitashi, i really understand what you're saying and I didn't know about many things you mention there, so, I'm sorry.

And you better start fixing your mistakes

Website · Post by **Johannez691** » February 6th, 2012, 1:45 pm

I agree with lots of things that Kitashi just wrote. The real Nightcore is Techno/Trance and are originally made by the Norwegian guys. And it's really bad for us ppl to speed up songs and call them Nightcore, whatever it's Techno, House or Rock. People will just see random speed up songs and call them Nightcore and the new generation won't have a clue that Nightcore really is the 2 Norwegian guys. But I don't think ppl are suppose to rename their songs now when we've seen this. The subscribers will start to wonder and would look kinda wierd. And if u wanna "Nightcore" Rock or House, that's perfecly fine. There aree many fans of Nightcore around the globe and everyone has their taste for Nightcore. But I will help. I will inform the subs about the real Nightcore in my videos in the describtion and post a link that will help them understand more. Nightcore, spped-up, call it whatever u want, But Nightcore is and will always be Norwegian.

RaveComing · Post by **RaveComing** » February 6th, 2012, 1:46 pm

Johannez691 wrote:I agree with lots of things that Kitashi just wrote. The real Nightcore is Techno/Trance and are originally made by the Norwegian guys. And it's really bad for us ppl to speed up songs and call them Nightcore, whatever it's Techno, House or Rock. People will just see random speed up songs and call them Nightcore and the new generation won't have a clue that Nightcore really is the 2 Norwegian guys. But I don't think ppl are suppose to rename their songs now when we've seen this. The subscribers will start to wonder and would look kinda wierd. And if u wanna "Nightcore" Rock or House, that's perfecly fine. There aree many fans of Nightcore around the globe and everyone has their taste for Nightcore. But I will help. I will inform the subs about the real Nightcore in my videos in the describtion and post a link that will help them understand more. Nightcore, spped-up, call it whatever u want, But Nightcore is and will always be Norwegian.

K cool. Then why name your sped up House tracks, Nightcore?

Website · Post by **Johannez691** » February 6th, 2012, 1:48 pm

It's still in the electronic genre. I think House is the limit. And as I said ppl call many genres Nightcore atm. But as I said. I will inform them more about Nightcore.

RaveComing · Post by **RaveComing** » February 6th, 2012, 1:49 pm

Johannez691 wrote:It's still in the electronic genre. I think House is the limit.

Well you think wrong. Many times before has it been stated that House was wrong. Yet you kept pushing. Shoot yourself in the foot more.

Website · Post by **Johannez691** » February 6th, 2012, 1:50 pm

Well, in that case I will only Nightcore in Techno/Trance from now on.

Post by **thecad** » February 6th, 2012, 1:50 pm

Johannez691 wrote:It's still in the electronic genre. I think House is the limit. And as I said ppl call many genres Nightcore atm. But as I said. I will inform them more about Nightcore. And if Nightcore is Norwegian, then Maikel shouldn't really call his videos Nightcores either. No hard feelings.

The one who is the closest to nightcore and does (my opinion) the best job at "Nightcoreing" at this moment is Maikel.
He is the one who kind of started the whole fan made nightcore scene.

Post by **Kirby** » February 6th, 2012, 1:50 pm

Johannez691 wrote:And if Nightcore is Norwegian, then Maikel shouldn't really call his videos Nightcores either. No hard feelings.

You're saying that Maikel does not make Nightcore songs because he is Dutch and not Norwegian? So basically, only Norwegian people can make Nightcore songs?

RaveComing · Post by **RaveComing** » February 6th, 2012, 1:51 pm

Johannez691 wrote:Well, in that case I will only Nightcore in Techno/Trance from now on.

And rename all your House uploads etc etc

Website · Post by **Johannez691** » February 6th, 2012, 1:51 pm

I will remove them. No use to have them left if they're called Speed up House.

Post by **thecad** » February 6th, 2012, 1:54 pm

Johannez691 wrote:Well, in that case I will only Nightcore in Techno/Trance from now on.

This is not really the case in my eyes. Maikel also got a very nice nightcore song of a "rock" song

Maikel:

Original:

RaveComing · Post by **RaveComing** » February 6th, 2012, 1:54 pm

thecad wrote:
Johannez691 wrote:Well, in that case I will only Nightcore in Techno/Trance from now on.
This is not really the case in my eyes. Maikel also got a very nice nightcore song of a "rock" song

Maikel:

Original:

Remixes are fine

Post by **thecad** » February 6th, 2012, 1:55 pm

RaveComing wrote:
thecad wrote:
Johannez691 wrote:Well, in that case I will only Nightcore in Techno/Trance from now on.
This is not really the case in my eyes. Maikel also got a very nice nightcore song of a "rock" song

Maikel:

Original:

Remixes are fine

It's not really a remix. In this video he used the original AND the tune up remix

Website · Post by **Johannez691** » February 6th, 2012, 1:56 pm

Whatever he did, it sounds good and sounds like Nightcore. Very good job by Maikel.

RaveComing · Post by **RaveComing** » February 6th, 2012, 1:56 pm

Mind you, both are actually remixes

Post by **Kirby** » February 6th, 2012, 1:58 pm

That's not the original. It's a cover of Alice Cooper's "Poison" by Groove Coverage. And even if it was, I have no clue how you could have interpretted that as a rock song anyways.

Bevarii · Post by **Bevarii** » February 6th, 2012, 2:01 pm

About the policy change topic: since sped up techno/dance qualifies as nightcore, trance does as well right?
I'm a bit confused about that now, so I thought I'd ask it here

Website · Post by **Maikel631** » February 6th, 2012, 2:08 pm

Damn, Kitashi, you deserve respect. This is such a post that was needed, and you were the one that actually went for it and wrote it. I applaud your effort in writing this post.

It is an explanation of what went wrong. I started this adventure without any expectations, then opportunities came knocking on my door. Back then in 2009, Michael wanted to start a forum about my channel and the Nightcore that I uploaded. Later on I decided to share my knowledge, and see if other people could make some nice Nightcore songs too, by making a "How to"-thread. My intention was to get people to make a Nightcore song how it should be done. We now see the result..

And yes, I hate it when people make speed edits, and label it Nightcore.. And even if it is influenced from the Nightcore method, it's still bullshit to label it Nightcore. For all these people it was freely accessible, their Myspace, there you see what kind of music there should be used. But no, people don't read, they never do.
The original idea just faded away, and yes, everyone, everyone forgot about it. I'm not lying when I say that it was all better in 2008/09. People who started at the same time as me, now turned into the same kind of uploaders, and because these days the newbies only get influenced by the high-viewed videos, it's pretty much doomed most of the time.

This all began when a lack of respect started occurring. I'm not saying I'm your god or something, no I'm not. But back in the days people thanked me for showing this to them. People came to me about it, I could inform them about it. Now everyone feels like they can do it on their own, they don't need me, it seems. Well, I can tell you that the percentage of failure is way higher now, nobody knows what Nightcore should be like. People read the tutorial, only the part of "23% to 25% raise in speed", or even only "raise speed", and the rest is history.

So the forum changed into a leech-hole really. And people started to post their own songs, which is not something I don't like, but the fact that quite a lot of them are pop/rock/wathever songs, just makes me go like ugh...
Maybe I should've said stuff about it long ago, though I kept thinking that it wouldn't reach people anyway. At this point in time most of the "community" is the sort of member of this community we don't want. Making a video about it won't help, because it wouldn't get viewed more than a few 1000 times, that's just not enough. Bulletins are useless, a topic here won't reach lots of people either.

That were and still are my thoughts. It's far beyond something I can turn around, or, well, can turn around alone. So.. I hope this can be a starting point, and we have to thank Kitashi for being brave enough for actually bringing it out there. I hope this can evolve into something.

I guess, together we are stronger. (Of course with together I mean the people who want to turn this around.. The people who want to do this, want Nightcore to be what it was like)

Bevarii · Post by **Bevarii** » February 6th, 2012, 2:13 pm

To be honest I would feel honored to get tips from you, Maikel.
I want to Nightcore songs as good as possible and I want to be sure I'm doing it right, so I'll read every comment on this thread to get as close as possible to create the right Nightcore music and to not spread the fake kind

RaveComing · Post by **RaveComing** » February 6th, 2012, 2:59 pm

Bevarii wrote:About the policy change topic: since sped up techno/dance qualifies as nightcore, trance does as well right?
I'm a bit confused about that now, so I thought I'd ask it here

Certain types of trance, like "Happy Trance" if I can put it that way (Splash, Rabaan, etc.) Not Armin van Buuren kinda trance. In doubt, post the song.

Post by **Kestrel0907** » February 6th, 2012, 4:00 pm

What if every uploader who read and aknowledged this,upload videos with information of this mess and either share those videos on comments,or say what's wrong on every video?
Maybe this might have a positive effect on them and stop what they are doing.

TimeToE · Post by **TimeToE** » February 6th, 2012, 5:59 pm

After this whole commotion I noticed in my short time being here, I really need to say I'm feeling really uneasy about trying to creat nightcore songs myself. I guess that I wish for more feedback and help in creating these songs oursselves (speaking for the beginners) so that such misconceptions and falsely labeled songs don't even appear as much as now (at least in the range of these forum). I now it means more work for you guys, who have the experience and are able to teach beginners what's important and what went wrong with their choises and methodes, but at least I think that would help renewing the respect for the original idea of nightcore and maybe it will spread beyond this forum and reach other uploaders.

Even though I think it will need some time to recreate the initial idea and view on nightcore, but we can at least start here on this forum, where we can even get "in contact" with "Teh Nightcore Source".

I'd like to take this opportunity to apologize for everything I may have done wrong and I really need help compensating mistakes (like choosing music genres; I can't really devide those; or anything else that went wrong). I am open for criticism on all of my videos and will change anything if it's needed.

Bevarii · Post by **Bevarii** » February 6th, 2012, 6:07 pm

TimeToE wrote:After this whole commotion I noticed in my short time being here, I really need to say I'm feeling really uneasy about trying to creat nightcore songs myself. I guess that I wish for more feedback and help in creating these songs oursselves (speaking for the beginners) so that such misconceptions and falsely labeled songs don't even appear as much as now (at least in the range of these forum). I now it means more work for you guys, who have the experience and are able to teach beginners what's important and what went wrong with their choises and methodes, but at least I think that would help renewing the respect for the original idea of nightcore and maybe it will spread beyond this forum and reach other uploaders.

Even though I think it will need some time to recreate the initial idea and view on nightcore, but we can at least start here on this forum, where we can even get "in contact" with "Teh Nightcore Source".

I'd like to take this opportunity to apologize for everything I may have done wrong and I really need help compensating mistakes (like choosing music genres; I can't really devide those; or anything else that went wrong). I am open for criticism on all of my videos and will change anything if it's needed.

This, exactly. This.

Post by **Kirby** » February 6th, 2012, 6:41 pm

This sort of thing has been going on for years .. and years. It's only coincidence that we're deciding to do something about it now. I was afraid that newer members would have a very hard time understanding how centralized the Nightcore community was around Maikel back in the days, and for what you could call good reason.

There isn't much any of us can do in regards to the surge of horrid Nightcore videos on YouTube, and I can really only see them escalating over the coming years. The best we can do is make sure the biggest Nightcore fan community on the web does pay due respect to the original Nightcore group, ridding ourselves of such rancid influences.

Maikel doesn't come around nearly as much as he used to, and pretty much only when I tell him to. I have a good feeling there's a better chance he'll be here more often if we can show him that he's welcome and will be respected here, as he was in the old days. I'm sure he'll be willing to help you guys out then.
Keep in mind however that you don't have to upload Nightcore yourself to be a fan of/appreciate Nightcore. If you're not going to do it properly, I would suggest you not do it at all.

Ppprre · Post by **Ppprre** » February 6th, 2012, 7:50 pm

I don't see why all of the new members always make nightcore now, instead of listening to it.( Although I would have tried to make nightcore songs, but I did not know where to find the music. ) I am not complaining but because of some bad songs I am very slow to listen to more than maikel's songs. I personally expected this forum to be more about the original nightcore group when I joined, but I was just as happy to find out it was mainly about maikel since he was the person to get me addicted to nightcore after I found out that the group did not make songs anymore. I was also scared when people started to have problems with the forum since it took me 16 years to find a genre I liked a lot and I never want to see maikel stop making music. ( I even check his songs to see if he gives any hints of stopping, so that I can try to persuade him not to. )

Website · Post by **Raver** » February 6th, 2012, 7:51 pm

Example of real Nightcore.

Post by **Kirby** » February 6th, 2012, 8:37 pm

Ppprre wrote:I personally expected this forum to be more about the original nightcore group when I joined

We certainly do that when news from them comes around, but there honestly isn't much about them to talk about.

TimeToE · Post by **TimeToE** » February 7th, 2012, 5:40 am

After reading the whole tread again, I think it may be valuable to mention the priorities of the content. It shouldn't be about presenting and promoting our own stuff as much as it is now, but rather about discussion the music we are presented from Maikel and other authentic nightcore uploaders.
I guess that was the mistake many people might have made when joining this forum (at least in my case).

And so I agree with Kirby to further enhance my post about getting help:

Kirby wrote:Keep in mind however that you don't have to upload Nightcore yourself to be a fan of/appreciate Nightcore. If you're not going to do it properly, I would suggest you not do it at all.

(I still hope for help from you guys though, cause I really enjoy creating some stuff myself ^^)

MisakuAideki · Post by **MisakuAideki** » February 7th, 2012, 7:11 am

Kitashi wrote:There's also the lot of you who seem to believe that making "Nightcore" versions out of rock songs is a perfectly acceptable and respectable act and that such songs deserve to be put under the same rave/dance category other Nightcore songs are, as well as worshipping/promoting the uploaders that do this.
People often resort to making "Nightcore" versions out of the typical rap/R&B/pop songs you hear on the radio. Some of you applaud these people for their blatant efforts and astounding amounts of originality.

That's right. I agree, 'cause it's the real situation of YouTube. I think a Nightcore song that isn't a techno song sounds bad...too bad...belonging that I don't really like House or Dubstep, but Nightcored they sound really bad.
Regarding Pop/Rap/R&B...it's the same...are not Nightcore songs...They seem like speeded up songs.
Rock music is the worst song that you can Nightcore...is very tight and sounds really BAD. I think so...Techno songs sound fine Nightcored, most of the times more fine than originals! That's all ;)